FIFE forums

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

News:

FIFE 0.4.0 has been released on 15th of January, 2017!

Pages: 1 [2] 3

Author Topic: FIFE legal issues - license switch and other possible options  (Read 26714 times)

mortiz

  • Newbie
  • Posts: 3
    • View Profile
Re: FIFE legal issues - license switch and other possible options
« Reply #15 on: January 18, 2008, 10:13:47 am »

I'm really easy on the issue myself, from reading all the options though probably #2 stands out the most.
Logged

shales

  • Newbie
  • Posts: 1
    • View Profile
Re: FIFE legal issues - license switch and other possible options
« Reply #16 on: January 18, 2008, 12:36:04 pm »

I'm fine with all the options as well..
Logged

mvBarracuda

  • Administrator
  • Sr. Member
  • *
  • Posts: 411
    • View Profile
Re: FIFE legal issues - license switch and other possible options
« Reply #17 on: January 23, 2008, 05:39:27 am »

A little status update concerning the license switch proposal. The following contributors did reply and expressed in some way that they at least agree to a LGPL switch or the GPL + exception license:
aldart
Anchorite
anxs
cheesesucker
chewie
chris
donbachi
jasoka
joshdan
jwt
mortiz
mutex
mvbarracuda
neurogeek
novade
ottar
phoku
prock
RogerWilco
Shadowdancer
shales
skybound
sleek
tesseract
virus
zahlman
zbyte64

The following people did neither answer here at the forums nor replied to my mails yet and will therefore receive another mail:
hahasound
ifoobar
ismarc
labrat
stro
undeadinsanity
vovansim

Code of these people who haven't replied yet does still reside in SVN trunk:
ifoobar (MSVC-specific compiler defines)
undeadinsanity (screenshot functionality)
vovansim (vfs zip support, unit tests, build scripts)

Caution: this list was compiled from the top of my head. In case I've listed anyone in the wrong category please reply here or send me a mail. I'll update this post of the next time to reflect the current situation.

EDIT: _virus__ agreed to it on IRC.
« Last Edit: February 10, 2008, 03:21:14 pm by mvBarracuda »
Logged

Tesseract

  • Newbie
  • Posts: 1
    • View Profile
Re: FIFE legal issues - license switch and other possible options
« Reply #18 on: January 23, 2008, 07:50:31 am »

Hmm, I'm not sure any of the code I wrote is even left in the current version, but since my opinion was asked…  ;D

Of the two possible changes, LGPL seems like the simplest and safest. A GPL exception would have to be very carefully worded in order to get the desired effect without any unwanted side-effects.

A few additional comments:
  • People who want to use open source code without opening their own code in return are the real freeloaders.
  • The GPL does not prevent commercial use at all. It prevents creating proprietary versions of the software.
  • Having an open source engine doesn't mean everyone is suddenly allowed to distribute your whole game for free. Look at Quake 3. Engine is now GPL'd, but data files are still proprietary.
Logged

Shadowdancer

  • Newbie
  • Posts: 2
    • View Profile
Re: FIFE legal issues - license switch and other possible options
« Reply #19 on: January 23, 2008, 12:45:53 pm »

Since my single contribution isn't even part of the development trunk, I don't mind.
Logged

Wuntvor

  • Developer
  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 9
    • View Profile
Re: FIFE legal issues - license switch and other possible options
« Reply #20 on: January 25, 2008, 03:29:07 pm »

For me, the more freedom for developers the better, so I'd be all for LGPL if possible.
Logged

mvBarracuda

  • Administrator
  • Sr. Member
  • *
  • Posts: 411
    • View Profile
Re: FIFE legal issues - license switch and other possible options
« Reply #21 on: January 25, 2008, 03:30:25 pm »

mvBarracuda: Could you please forward the email from the sflc? I wonder how this GPL + exception stuff can work (the way I read GPL section 2.b I would assume it breaks the license, but obviously the sflc guys know better).
Sorry, I overlooked your post :-/

Just sent the mail to you :-)
Logged

chewie

  • Developer
  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 123
    • View Profile
    • zero-projekt.net
Re: FIFE legal issues - license switch and other possible options
« Reply #22 on: January 28, 2008, 05:03:27 am »

I would prefer a license which allows developers to hold back certain parts of their (own) code - if they wish to do so. On the other hand I´d like to see FIFE itself under GPL ...

Especially when it comes to the commercial use of FIFE (by "independent" developers) there must be a way for the company to ensure that the product is bought instead of downloaded.*

So #2 would be a good solution. :)

* I believe that FIFE can push the market of independent 2D isometric games and can help small teams to bring their ideas onto the screen. Last but not least I see a chance to get more native games for Linux (both commercial and freeware / OSS). ;-)

donbachi

  • Developer
  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 1
    • View Profile
Re: FIFE legal issues - license switch and other possible options
« Reply #23 on: February 10, 2008, 02:32:39 pm »

Hi all,

as my contributions so far have been very, very small, I can go with any of the propoded options.
From a more logical point of view, option #2 sounds the most reasonably for me.
But again, I'm fine with any of them.


Bye,

    donbachi
Logged

quasius

  • Newbie
  • Posts: 3
    • View Profile
Re: FIFE legal issues - license switch and other possible options
« Reply #24 on: February 24, 2008, 12:16:12 pm »

Consider me an indie developer who is interested in FIFE and would gladly contribute any core-engine enhancements I will probably make.  Unfortunately, I'll have to pass on FIFE altogether if I can only release my product under the GPL.
Logged

mvBarracuda

  • Administrator
  • Sr. Member
  • *
  • Posts: 411
    • View Profile
Re: FIFE legal issues - license switch and other possible options
« Reply #25 on: February 24, 2008, 02:34:06 pm »

Welcome to the forums quasius :-)

Your statement was a good reminder that I should actually update this thread with the current status of the license switch process. I did try to get in contact with all developers who contributed code to FIFE in the last weeks; unfortunately I wasn't able to reach all of them with the contact information they provided.

The following developers haven't replied to my mails yet:
hahasound
ifoobar
ismarc
labrat
stro
undeadinsanity
vovansim

While all of them contributed code to the project, the code of some contributors is not present anymore in trunk. So what is left and would need to get removed if we want to switch to the LGPL?

1. Screenshot functionality originally implemented by undeadinsanity. Jasoka mentioned that the current code in place might be inspired by popular textbook examples. In this case we would just need to remove the custom code that was written by undeadinsanity I guess.

Changesets of undeadinsanity:
http://mirror1.cvsdude.com/trac/fife/engine/search?q=undeadinsanity&wiki=on&changeset=on&ticket=on

2. A couple of unit tests and zip support. Both has been implemented by vovansim. The old zip code was recently replaced by a new implementation written by chris. So we won't need to worry about reimplementing this functionality anymore. I'm not sure which unit tests have been written by Vovansim so this might be worth investigating. While rewriting these unit tests from scratch is surely quite some work, it sounds like we're able to tackle this in a reasonable timespan.

Changesets of vovansim:
http://mirror1.cvsdude.com/trac/fife/engine/search?q=vovansim&noquickjump=1&ticket=on&changeset=on&wiki=on

My personal proposal for the next steps:
1. Try to find an alternative way to contact vovansim & undeadinsanity; might be possible with social engineering. I can take care of that.
2. In case we're not able to reach them in a period of two weeks: identify and document the contributions of vovansim & undeadinsanity. Furthermore document if their code is still in place. Find out what parts of the screenshot code are taken from free sample implementations.
3. Create trac tickets to reimplement the documented functionality that is still in place from these two contributors.
4. Release FIFE 2008.1 under LGPL :-)

Hopefully that works out like planned.
Logged

quasius

  • Newbie
  • Posts: 3
    • View Profile
Re: FIFE legal issues - license switch and other possible options
« Reply #26 on: February 24, 2008, 03:43:41 pm »

Well, it sounds like you might be on track to update the license then.  Based on that, I'll probably start poking around the FIFE code.  If you don't end up switching, I'll have to drop it and go back to Torque or something; but this engine is far more specific to what I need, so I'd like to use it.
Hopefully the switch goes well, as I'd be glad to redistribute any core engine improvements I'd need to make in exchange for being able to sell a FIFE game commercially.
Logged

Sadr

  • Newbie
  • Posts: 34
    • View Profile
    • Radakan
Re: FIFE legal issues - license switch and other possible options
« Reply #27 on: February 28, 2008, 05:13:08 pm »

Ehm, I'm probably not gonna be contributing any content that will be going under a license anyhow, but sure, you got my consent ;)

(...)
Especially when it comes to the commercial use of FIFE (by "independent" developers) there must be a way for the company to ensure that the product is bought instead of downloaded.
(...)
Are you guys planning to make FIFE a commercial product?
Logged

snowball

  • Newbie
  • Posts: 10
    • View Profile
Re: FIFE legal issues - license switch and other possible options
« Reply #28 on: February 29, 2008, 12:09:03 am »

Quote
Are you guys planning to make FIFE a commercial product?

No, Zero will be free of charge. But there can always be developers like quasius who want to sell their games.
Logged

mvBarracuda

  • Administrator
  • Sr. Member
  • *
  • Posts: 411
    • View Profile
Re: FIFE legal issues - license switch and other possible options
« Reply #29 on: March 18, 2008, 07:38:34 pm »

I did try to reach the developers who didn't reply to the license change proposal mails yet. Unfortunately none of them replied :-/ It seems that code of the following developers still resides in trunk:
1. Vovansim: C++ boost unit tests
2. Arron / undeadinsanity: screenshot code (might be based on some book examples and he might therefore not hold any copyright on this implementation)

My personal proposal is:
1. Create trac tickets to remove / replace the mentioned functionality (done)
2. Send out a final license change agreement email and wait until the developers have agreed to the change
3. Actually remove vovansim's & arron's code
4. Ship the 2008.1 release under LGPL

As far as I can tell all developers would be fine with both license proposals (GPL + exception & LGPL) but the majority of the active developers seems to favour the LGPL because of its clarity. If nobody objects I'll word a final license change email that states that we want to switch to LGPL and asks for the agreement of all developers who contributed code to the project.

Tickets for removing / reimplementing code by developers who haven't agreed to the license switch proposal:
http://mirror1.cvsdude.com/trac/fife/engine/ticket/309
http://mirror1.cvsdude.com/trac/fife/engine/ticket/310
Logged
Pages: 1 [2] 3